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valleygroomer

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Reply with quote  #46 

G'mornin'

But that doesn't mean you throw in the towel.  Why can't groomers gather (on their own time = like here  lol), and hammer down exactly what they would like to see in the bill?  This would ensure that all angles (sides) are covered and that each area within our industry is covered.  I am not suggesting that we give these responsibilities to the special interests groups or politicians, but combine efforts with every group that is involved with the grooming industry, and build the platform from this information.  This way we would be sure to include even the most routine details and descriptions to the folks who have already covered this.  And focus on areas that are yet to be covered in depth/detail.

 

So, this is strange but, if you will...  Removed yourself from this for one moment...  Where do you come from...  I really don't want to know, but I ask this to remind ourselves that we are all from somewhere else here in North America, unless you are a native...  OK, so my point is... We came to the new world and brought the breeds with us (or most of the breeds), the standard of the breed did not commence in N America, but where the dog originated, so why can't we study how these folks (you know - over there), deal with such a subject as licensing for our industry.  So, what I mean is if we set the "standard" for the grooming industry, to be based solely on the traditional breed standards (which one would have to), then this makes our task less complicated.  We are not creating something new... We simply need to recognize that in other places of the world (England/Europe), the dog world has been bubbling for many many many years.  So why not pay attention to their detail and create a model from their examples/activity combined with the activity of today, and go from there. 

 

The special interests groups offer a neutral platform for groomers to take part in seminars, testing and certification.  They do a good job of it, so we can tap into their resources, allow them to certify the groomers as well as providing entertainment and skill testing through the creative grooming competitions...  What a great way to learn, not for the beginner but certainly for the seasoned groomer.

 

I really like the idea of somehow structuring our industry so that it  protects the groomer, the pet and the industry - But I really think we need to all collaborate on how this is to be presented in the form of the bill - It's up to us to let them know what they need to cover or go further into some detail on. 

 

Really that bill was sooo long, I guess if you were working on that bill from when the whole thing began, perhaps you would feel like you have accomplished something as well, maybe the author(s) ran out of steam, or got distracted from the task at hand - This is where a larger group of individuals from every background could add their input, analyse, critique so to hammer out exactly what WE want to see in the bill that will decide how the world of dog grooming will look tomorrow...
Peace & Love


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Persistence prevails when all else fails...
Canyon

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Reply with quote  #47 

I have been grooming for about 6 years. The woman who taught me how to groom opened a business with me about a year ago. I have no problem with grooming salons being licensed and inspected because that would force owners to keep the salon clean and be responsible about the care they provide to their customers (pets). It should be no different than the inspections done at kennels and day-cares. What concerns me is that while it may weed out the underground or "basement" groomers, it may also weed out the ones who are good at their jobs but just can't afford the license. I feel that I am a good groomer but we have only been in business for ourselves for a year. I can barely afford to make my car payment let alone pay for classes I really don't need so I can learn things I already know how to do! Who does the testing? What does the test involve? Who is to say that what one groomer does is right and what another does is wrong? We all have are own style of grooming, while it may not be breed standard, who cares as long as the customer is happy, right? I don't groom show dogs, I groom pets. What can we do? Who do I call?

valleygroomer

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Reply with quote  #48 

Greetings...  As I type from under boxes!!!  Breed standards are our guidelines for the everyday grooms we do in the shops.  Never do we state that a dog must be done to standard, especially when dealing with pets...  We use this form or standard to get an idea for what to do or how to shape the dogs hair du, and then the owner wants it to look their way...  So we end up blending all these for our own picture of what this should be.  Ultimately the owner decides what the dog looks like, but for someone who doesn't know how their pet should look, it is nice to have a Dog's Annual handy to pull out and make reference to, then at least yo have a photo in front of the owner, and you can then suggest your own modifications you would recommend for a pet - maintenance/snow balls, mud, matting, etc. - Lifestyle of the owner...  All of these are factors that go into deciding the shape of the hair du or the standard/pet modified...  So, you see the show ring is great for a reminder of what the dog is supposed to look like, after that it is up to the judge - or rather the owner.

 

As far as the testing goes, if you check out one of the assoc that are offering testing (there is a few), you will read their protocol, and where when why, etc

 

Cheers, and happy grooming!


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Persistence prevails when all else fails...
gretchen

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Reply with quote  #49 
There is a group of us in PA  trying to organize an association to deal with the legislation ( HB 2194). I am surprised there isn't more going on to opppose this bill, I mean it says they can fine or IMPRISON a person for a first offense! It also says they can suspend a license for up to 6 months while a hearing is deciding a complaint. I don't even know what they consider an offense! They haven't gotten that far. This isn't about setting standards, it's about getting even. Supposedly Rep. O'Neall's 12yr old Golden died after he returned from the groomers. Oh, and you must post a sign in an obvious place with the phone number of the grievance committee. I don't think this is about bettering our profession. Any PA groomer interested please e-mail me at lgoldner@ptd.net
thegroomer

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Reply with quote  #50 

I have groomer for 35 years and have been on the fence concerning licensing, however I am seeing the need for groomers to become licensed in order to prevent others, such at veterinarian, from coming in and mandating to us how we can operate. I have also seen groomers who need more education or who should be prohibitted from grooming.

We need to protect ALL the animals who are professionally groomed and protect our industry. I do not like the idea od more government interferrence but if it is reasonable and beneficial to the grooming industry than I am for it and have decided to get it going in Idaho.

We must write our own legislation to protect ourselves from legislation written by someone who is angry or "out to get" groomers.

There is a lot about the PA bill that I do not like. It is too harsh and restrictive and sounds very complicated and expensive. We can and should do better.

laurie

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Reply with quote  #51 

Did anyone else see the article on licenses in PA in the new Pet Product News Mag? Gives a lot of info and explanation. 

pawprintz

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Reply with quote  #52 

I live in Pa. and have been in the grooming business for 35 years. I have a so called certificate from a school of Grooming . I have no idea if they were accredited back then . My husband and I also breed Alaskan Malamutes and showed them .I worked with a professional handler about 3 yrs when I was in my twenties and used to travel the circuit with her and do grooming to get her clients dogs ready for the show ring. I have my own in home shop, which I have worked my butt off to have . I just do toy and small breeds now and don't over book as I have gotten a little slower but still in great shape to handle my business I have customers that just don't want to stop coming to me and get very upset if I say I am going to retire . I constantly get recommendations even from area vets.

Anyway most of you who are mulling over this licensing bill have no idea what the politicians are like here in Pa. You will all be sorry if this bill  spreads like a cancer to other states. I can hardly afford the school taxes in the area and they charge me for water from my own well. The more government sticks there nose in stuff the worse things get. What it really going to happen is that places Petco and other large grooming corps. are going to knock the small groomer out of business and then you Will go to work for them because you won't be able to afford your own shop .You will work for crumbs while they make big bucks off your work. Don't be blind to whats going on ,the small business owner is soon going to be a thing of the past.

Pa. has also always been a farming state too ,and now farmers are going out of business left and right with farms that have been handed down from generation to generation all because government is killing there lively hood and corporate farms are moving in and the animals are treated worse and the corporate farms are so huge they just snub there nose up at complaints and don't even bother what the government says . Believe me when I tell you this bill the way it is written is not in the groomers best interest. Anyone that is on this message board from Pa. Needs to get involved  and contact there state legislators stop this bill before it is passed.  I have been around a long time in the industry and God help us if this goes through. Look  up the bill for yourselves it's House Bill 2194 P.N. I doesn't just have a few bad quirks it's majorly messed up! Once it passed they won't change it.

 

pawprintz

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Reply with quote  #53 

Check out the Liscensing bill at this site. http://www.legis.state.pa.us/WU01/LI/BI/BT/2005/0/HB2194P3049.HTM

enchantedsaluki

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Reply with quote  #54 

There seems like there must be a way to find a middle ground-- I agree that there should be standards for the profession, but that it should protect us as the groomers as well as the pets. Certain training in the proper handling of animals, and emergency care, as well as grooming, as well. I think you are right in that this is way too complicated and detailed and gives Big Brother too much control. It is sad that Corporate America is making it virtually impossible for small business owners to survive.

 

The thought of the corporate pet shops taking over makes me shiver; a friend of mine works at a PetCo and she said that the groomers there look at her funny because she kisses the dogs, plays with them, gets them squeaky clean and obsesses over getting every hair just right. The manager there said she needn't bother do all that because "It's just PetCo", and the other groomers leave hairs sticking out all over the place and don't show any personal care towards the dogs. They have become corporate robotic dog assembly-line workers just pushing as many dogs through as possible.

 

There must be a middle ground... and it should be one of the national grooming organizations, or at least groomers, who decide all of this...

pawprintz

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Reply with quote  #55 

cassandra  I have no idea what will become of the small business groomer that will have to deal with bill. Those of us who are groomers in Pa. Need to stand up and be counted. This is going to be another revenue money maker for the state and once again dipping into the pockets of small business. Our prices will again have to go up for grooming will there be no end . Soon only the rich will be able to afford a pet and have it groomed.

And someone on the board mentioned about seniors in Florida going to an older groomer who's prices were a bit cheaper then hers. Well I gotta say seniors just love there pets and yes they will go to someone who gives seniors a break but they will never settle for lousy treatment of there pets or bad grooming. And if that groomer that has the cheaper prices wasn't a good groomer they would me knocking down the other groomer door. I always give seniors a break in price they deserve it. You'd be surprised how many give big tips and gifts for a grooming well done. And most are lonely and like a little kind conversation and attention themselves. Just getting out to take there pet to the groomer brightens there day.

gretchen

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Reply with quote  #56 
I think the best alternative to this bill, is to license the shop instead of the groomer. Other states do this. And require liability insurance. Insurance underwriters won't give insurance without proof of some kind that you are not a risk to them. If a shop has insurance the owner is responsible for what happens there, just like it is now. The shop gets inspected periodically and customer grievances go to the the dog warden who does the inspection. There are people in this industry who's agenda is a "quality groom" and trying to upgrade our "professionalism". These are not bad causes, but frankly are not the states business. ONLY SAFETY should be the concern of the state. Everyone knows a grromer who can't do a decent shnauzer or whatever, but that is for the client to decide. And don't even get me started on misbehaving pets who won't stand for a proper groom. Not to mention matted wonders who are a risk when they walk in the door. But if you're on this board then you know what I mean. We just need to protect pets from repeat offender groomers and give the public a way to be heard.
thegroomer

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Reply with quote  #57 

Colorado licenses the shops. All they do is take $100 yr (if I remember the amt. correctly) and send you a lic. there was no inspections, nothing only the bill. I don't know if they do anything else, I never saw or heard of it.

We need more and it needs to be done BY Groomers not polititions or vets. 

luvgoldens

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Reply with quote  #58 

Gretchen, I think you said it perfectly...licensing needs to be about safety for the pets. Let the customer decide whether or not they like my poodle "top knot."

pawprintz

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Reply with quote  #59 

I can hardly believe that this message board is not packed with comments and opinions after the big meeting last night on the Licinsing Bill.

laurie

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Reply with quote  #60 

What meeting? What happened? I'm in FL and haven't heard anything new.

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